America Finally Makes Plans For Its Own Nuclear Fusion Power Plant

Discussion in 'Energy & Fuel' started by Frank Sanoica, Dec 12, 2020.

  1. Frank Sanoica

    Frank Sanoica Supreme Member
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    The title itself is dubious, and misleading.

    • "Scientists and the U.S. Department of Energy (DoE) have collaborated on a comprehensive new nuclear fusion plan.
    • This is the first agreement of its kind in the U.S., representing years of work and cooperation.
    • ITER's success or failure in the 2030s will make a huge difference in our plans.
    For the first time, a major group of American scientists has agreed to work toward opening a nuclear fusion plant by the 2040s."

    This business has been in the "stew" for decades now. Apparently, more B.S. is deemed needed to spread the gospel more widely among the taxpayers. Process seems to have been, "Make it bigger, then it will work".

    [​IMG]

    They ought to name this "Biggest Boon-doggle Yet". Look at the size of this structure!

    By comparison all of Hoover Dam's generators would fit inside this thing, providing millions of watts of power, whereas the scientists will be pleased if the fusion scheme produces a hundred watts of usable power, while consuming Hoover's output entirely in doing so.

    Frank
     
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  2. Jeff Elohim

    Jeff Elohim Very Well-Known Member
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    ...
    There was a working, usable, reproducable, in action already working for many people
    plan for an electric generator
    that cost , in 1970-1980,
    about $50.00. plus the time and labor to assemble it. Maybe $100 to $400 if paying someone to do it.
    It was in Mother Earth News, and maybe also Popular Science ...

    Later, in PS, around 1997, there was a 70 cubic foot fuel cell with no moving parts and no maintenance costs most years that provided completely all the electricity needed for a huge ski resort in Maine/ or Appalachian Mtns, remote from any power lines....
    That fuel cell cost $6000, to $7000, before the year 2000. It was "supposed to" be available by 2002.

    Well, 2002 came and went - it never became available to regular people - the resorts and the governments and the military purchases of the fuel cell were said to be $125,000 per unit....

    If someone already had one, the cost previously , like to the resorts, was about 3 cents or less per kwh provided, with enough power available without strain to power all the residences in a ten city block area, if used in the city.
     
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  3. Ed Wilson

    Ed Wilson Veteran Member
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    The major problem of fusion reactors is how to construct a vessel to contain the reaction I have read. Suspending it in a magnetic field was under consideration.
     
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  4. Frank Sanoica

    Frank Sanoica Supreme Member
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    @Jeff Elohim

    Yes, it takes available energy, which exists in only a few forms, to produce electric power, which is yet another form of energy. Energy exists as HEAT, KINETIC (moving mass), ELECTROMAGNETIC ENERGY, and various types thereof, such as tides. Producing electricity simply involves converting one available energy type into electrical energy. Hydropower, dams, do this by using moving water to spin electrical generators, which produce the power.

    A typical HEAT produced electricity derives from burning FUEL, to produce steam which spins generators in much the same way water does. Alternate HEAT sources, one being the Sun, are currently being used in this manner.

    Nuclear reactions produce extreme amounts of heat of extremely high temperature potential, such as in Nuclear Generating Plants, which also produce steam. The one nuclear reaction most attractive is the FUSION REACTION, that practically has so far been elusive, whose fuel is basically water (hydrogen), of which unlimited supply exists. Fusing together hydrogen atoms to form helium atoms develops unimaginable amounts of heat, usable to produce electricity, the process so far being unattainable in other than hydrogen bombs.

    Frank
     
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  5. Frank Sanoica

    Frank Sanoica Supreme Member
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    @Ed Wilson

    This is exactly right. When a hydrogen bomb explodes, the heat generated is of such intensity that it VAPORIZES everything near it: wood, steel, concrete, EVERYTHING. Magnetic fields, able to "contain" the fusing hydrogen atoms on a small scale, require gobs of energy being maintained, more than results from the desired fusion reactions.

    Frank
     
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  6. Trevalius Guyus

    Trevalius Guyus Veteran Member
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    BIG mistake!!!
     
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  7. Jeff Elohim

    Jeff Elohim Very Well-Known Member
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    Side note: I think there are hundreds of references (including on youtube, homemade and other videos) online to grade school or high school students showing "cold fusion" .

    Maybe in a new or different way(s), maybe not enuf to use commercially, safely, or economically.
     
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  8. Frank Sanoica

    Frank Sanoica Supreme Member
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    @Jeff Elohim

    It does not take tremendous outside force, energy, or influence if you will, to make up a fissioning mass of easily critical material such as U235 or Pu239 (Uranium or Plutonium). In fact two individuals died horrible deaths while doing prompt critical experimentation to determine the fission characteristics and parameters of a hunk of Plutonium, which came to be known as the "Demon Core". Highly knowledgeable scientists, Louis Slotin and Harry Daghlian were exposed to lethal amounts of radiation while working with Plutonium. The units of radiation measurement, the RAD, used back then, was known to produce 50% lethality at about 600 RADS whole body exposure; these guys received 10,000 + RADS. Both knew they were "dead men" immediately following their "incidents". Human error in manipulating a mechanism controlling the fission reaction allowed a "runaway" in each case. In use was a sphere of Plutonium about the size of an orange.

    upload_2021-3-2_22-6-3.jpeg

    upload_2021-3-2_22-6-35.jpeg

    A metallic shell was lowered over the Pu core slowly, allowing otherwise escaping neutrons to cause further fissions, until in a tiny fraction of a second, the room was FILLED with untold trillions of free neutrons, exposing everyone in the lab.

    upload_2021-3-2_22-8-46.jpeg
    Slotin was closest, doing the work, had an extremely high level of intellect; he told everyone present not to move, and carefully estimated their locations so as to estimate their relative exposure; there were 8 in the lab. He sketched a diagram showing their positions for the doctors to consider in treating the victims who survived. Slotin then collapsed outdoors. His parents were flown in to Los Alamos to be with their son, as he died, a horrible death. Daghlian died similarly. See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harry_Daghlian#Criticality_accident

    Point to be made is that FUSION, the other major nuclear reaction, unlike FISSION, will not commence without the presence of exceedingly high temperatures, over a million degrees. Such temperatures are so far only known to exist via the explosive fission reaction of materials, an atomic bomb can achieve it.

    Frank
     
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