Bible Questions

Discussion in 'Faith & Religion' started by Bob Kirk, May 4, 2019.

  1. Bob Kirk

    Bob Kirk Veteran Member
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    I as questions because for me logic, bible stories & fact don't to mesh well. Ken pointed out, questioning can upset some people, I don't ask in order to upset, I'm truly curious about what seem to me to conflict. Ken did point out it's been 40 years since he attended bible college so what ever insight he might post I will appreciate.

    Something as simple as making the earth & universe puzzles me. Where did the sentient being come from to make that happen? If from some other place the next question would be are there other planets with human life forms? Science is working on proving this.
    Scientists discover possible first proof of parallel universes
    A study on the strange Cold Spot in space may prove that we live in a multiverse.
    Paul Ratner
    18 May, 2017
    https://bigthink.com/paul-ratner/scientists-find-what-could-be-the-first-proof-of-parallel-universes

    That is not fact only that science is probing new discoveries.

    The Lambda-CDM concordance model describes the evolution of the universe from a very uniform, hot, dense primordial state to its present state over a span of about 13.8 billion years[4] of cosmological time. This model is well understood theoretically and strongly supported by recent high-precision astronomical observations such as WMAP.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_the_universe

    13.8 billion give or take several million years is open to how the Hebrew language is interpreted. Accepting that a day could be a billion years works since fitting the bible narrative of 6 days needs an explanation. No way to know what the true intent was.
     
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  2. Joy Martin

    Joy Martin Veteran Member
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    I think about a gf who said she started to question our religion when she was in 5th grade, she later in life was indoctrinated into JW and this caused a major drift and divorce in her life, but she claims to be happy with JW...she's a fun gal and we don't talk about religion much at all. I tried many after I left my born into religion and now live by the principles of Power of Positive Thinking. This fits best for me.
     
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  3. Don Alaska

    Don Alaska Supreme Member
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    One of my college friends--one of the three brilliant people I have known over my life--was an Atheist who married a conservative Christian. His wife converted to JW after marriage and we all thought their marriage would fall to pieces. Not so--they have stayed together almost 50 years now and have three children and quite a number of grands. It is interesting though, that we receive Christmas cards from him (the Atheist) but his wife doesn't celebrate any religious or other holiday. He says he enjoys the cultural value of Christmas.
     
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  4. Joy Martin

    Joy Martin Veteran Member
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    My ex was a religious genius when we married, but after our move to CA, he got involved with a 2 x's divorced atheist...he was gone. I finally was gone too years later and not until I was in my 60's.. He had book smarts but was void in common sense.

    One thing I remember about my JW friend, don't wish happy birthday and don't send cards for sure. I'm ok with that...I'm tired of sending cards anyway. We have a lot of other stuff in common, like our health healing methods.
     
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  5. Jeff Elohim

    Jeff Elohim Very Well-Known Member
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    It is perhaps surprising that so many groups in the usa and the world/ Canada/ Alaska/ Mexico/ and other countries for thousands of years and recently
    have great healing methods
    made illegal by congress by order of the drug lords (makers).

    The wide spread use of healing methods in the past makes it a little easier for some people to find out how to heal almost anything (including over 100 diseases claimed to be incurable by pharmakeia and congress and doctros)
    so if anyone seeks, and keeps seeking , they can find. (even in a nursing home, though that might be an obstacle )
     
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  6. Jeff Elohim

    Jeff Elohim Very Well-Known Member
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    That is a very very very important question Frank. It is in error though, assuming that God empowered mere humans to enlighten humanity. That goes against what God Says and what God Reveals in His Word.

    Oh, God did choose , before creating the world, messengers to send, angels and men(apostles, etc),
    to deliver His message, that is truth.
    But a man can hear the message from a man, or from an angel, or even from someone risen from the dead, and refuse to believe it - thus remaining unenlightened and unregenerated, remaining opposed to Jesus, opposed to God, opposed to Scripture, opposed to Life Eternal and remaining an enemy of truth, an enemy of God and an enemy not just of Jesus, but also an enemy of people, as they seek the destruction of people's souls far and wide, near and distant, under the power of the prince of the power of the air (the devil), as written in Ephesians 2.

    God does 'instantly" instill, or rather 'reveals', His Truth to little children, as Jesus gives thanks to Him for doing so, for that is God's Good Pleasure So To Do,
    and
    God also hides the Truth, hides Salvation , as Jesus reveals openly and out loud in Scripture,
    hides Salvation from the educated.
    Another way this is written: God is opposed to the proud, but gives grace to the humble.
     
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  7. Joseph Carl

    Joseph Carl Very Well-Known Member
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    For those seeking God and truth, supposed Bible contradictions and scientific concerns can be logically reconciled. For the skeptic with a chosen world view, no amount of answers or evidence will be satisfying. Thus, I'll pass on Bob's OP questions, focusing instead on this one disturbing response.

    Don Alaska says: "I am not sure I understand why anyone is hung up on Genesis, which is basically a collection of allegories used to communicate ideas to people 2 millennia ago."

    I understand why you might say this Don since it's a common view of Genesis that's become even more popularized since the 19th century secular trend with science. Let me make two points.

    First, the controversial verses of Genesis 1-11 are clearly written in a Hebrew style that demonstrates true historical accounts - not poetry, nor parable, nor allegory. The world's best Hebrew Biblical scholars agree on this fact (and I have one excellent video affirming this). So while nonbelievers reject Genesis to justify their world view and believers distort Genesis to accommodate their confused worldly God view, the author of Genesis did not allow for such ambiguity. Like the other thousands of specific names, dates, and places recorded throughout the Bible, Genesis is certainly a record of historical accounts. And to date, archaeology and science continue to confirm many of these historical accounts.

    Second, the reason for people to be "hung up" on Genesis is quite appropriate; in fact, I'm disappointed that more believers don't understand the issue as well as the unbelievers. The unbelievers, and especially outspoken Atheists, understand that long ages are essential to explain seemingly impossible evolutionary processes, and that evolution is necessary to explain away the existence of God. The believers unfortunately don't understand this and try to reconcile the two opposing belief systems. This is where a majority of people go wrong: assuming that a literal interpretation of Genesis and modern science are incompatible. If they would study the subject fairly, they would learn that the historical Genesis accounts are far more consistent with our known laws of science than the evolution and secular views being embraced today.

    Why is Genesis important? Because the reliability of the entire Bible, its authority of representing truth, depends on it. If Genesis is wrong, then why should anyone trust the rest of the Bible? If a Christian can't even trust Moses' 6-day creation and global flood account which is actually consistent with cosmology, astronomy, physics, and geological evidence, then why should he trust a virgin birth account that has absolutely no scientific evidence supporting it? You see, Genesis holds numerous details and doctrines that are referenced throughout the rest of the Bible. It's the Christian (and Jewish) faith's scriptural foundation. Without it's absolute truth and authority, the faith stands no better than other man made false religions.

    So yes, the truth of Genesis matters a lot, and it's undermining by secular forces is the biggest cause for the increase in Atheism among America's youth today. The Devil's battleground against Christianity in some places is being pursued with serious persecution of the believers, but another battleground affecting even more souls is being waged worldwide against the faith's foundation - the discrediting of Genesis.
     
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  8. Don Alaska

    Don Alaska Supreme Member
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    I never meant Genesis was not important, but I feel it is one of those books compiled by various authors and passed down over hundred of years orally. There has to be contradiction, embellishment, and changes that occurred in the bokk over that time. I was saying it is not a theological masterpiece upon which your faith should depend. Much of Genesis appears to be "borrowed" from the Book of Enoch and other more ancient texts.
     
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  9. Jeff Elohim

    Jeff Elohim Very Well-Known Member
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    QUOTE="Joseph Carl, post: 515591, member: 1227"]For those seeking God and truth, supposed Bible contradictions and scientific concerns can be logically reconciled. For the skeptic with a chosen world view, no amount of answers or evidence will be satisfying. Thus, I'll pass on Bob's OP questions, focusing instead on this one disturbing response.

    Don Alaska says: "I am not sure I understand why anyone is hung up on Genesis, which is basically a collection of allegories used to communicate ideas to people 2 millennia ago."

    I understand why you might say this Don since it's a common view of Genesis that's become even more popularized since the 19th century secular trend with science. Let me make two points.

    First, the controversial verses of Genesis 1-11 are clearly written in a Hebrew style that demonstrates true historical accounts - not poetry, nor parable, nor allegory. The world's best Hebrew Biblical scholars agree on this fact (and I have one excellent video affirming this). So while nonbelievers reject Genesis to justify their world view and believers distort Genesis to accommodate their confused worldly God view, the author of Genesis did not allow for such ambiguity. Like the other thousands of specific names, dates, and places recorded throughout the Bible, Genesis is certainly a record of historical accounts. And to date, archaeology and science continue to confirm many of these historical accounts.

    Second, the reason for people to be "hung up" on Genesis is quite appropriate; in fact, I'm disappointed that more believers don't understand the issue as well as the unbelievers. The unbelievers, and especially outspoken Atheists, understand that long ages are essential to explain seemingly impossible evolutionary processes, and that evolution is necessary to explain away the existence of God. The believers unfortunately don't understand this and try to reconcile the two opposing belief systems. This is where a majority of people go wrong: assuming that a literal interpretation of Genesis and modern science are incompatible. If they would study the subject fairly, they would learn that the historical Genesis accounts are far more consistent with our known laws of science than the evolution and secular views being embraced today.

    Why is Genesis important? Because the reliability of the entire Bible, its authority of representing truth, depends on it. If Genesis is wrong, then why should anyone trust the rest of the Bible? If a Christian can't even trust Moses' 6-day creation and global flood account which is actually consistent with cosmology, astronomy, physics, and geological evidence, then why should he trust a virgin birth account that has absolutely no scientific evidence supporting it? You see, Genesis holds numerous details and doctrines that are referenced throughout the rest of the Bible. It's the Christian (and Jewish) faith's scriptural foundation. Without it's absolute truth and authority, the faith stands no better than other man made false religions.

    So yes, the truth of Genesis matters a lot, and it's undermining by secular forces is the biggest cause for the increase in Atheism among America's youth today. The Devil's battleground against Christianity in some places is being pursued with serious persecution of the believers, but another battleground affecting even more souls is being waged worldwide against the faith's foundation - the discrediting of Genesis.[/QUOTE


    ===========================================
    Earlier this morning I was thinking of posting a new thread titled something like "In The Beginning" There Was No Pollution.

    Not just nor only physical pollution, which kills over 12,000 people daily now (they tried to blame a fake virus for that),

    but mental confusion-pollution common in all mankind,

    and spiritual pollution, also present almost everywhere, even in churches in the New Testament accounts of assemblies of Ekklesia (set apart ones, born again by the Will of the Father in Heaven). Thus the Instructions in the Epistles, etc, what to do about the spiritual pollution present in the assemblies of Ekklesia. (nothing is to be done (except prayer when permitted) for the spiritual pollution present in the groups of carnal admirerers serving idols and/or demons).
     
    #24
  10. Lambert Regenlöf

    Lambert Regenlöf Well-Known Member
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    You say you aren't a Bible student, but the questions you raise show that you are. Not in the sense of a Bible believer, but of a Bible critic.
    How is this not a good sign of a loving creator?
     
    #25
  11. Frank Sanoica

    Frank Sanoica Supreme Member
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    @Lambert Regenlöf

    Over my entire lifetime, through a variety of meanderings among religious folks including some relatives, neighbors, stories told and listened to, it has been unwaveringly stated that the Lord is a kind, just, and honest,as well as forgiving Lord.

    This failed to explain the wars, both religious and otherwise, bloodshed, deeply rooted pain and anxiety, truthlessness, ruthlessness, and failure to care compassionately about others.

    Frank
     
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  12. Bobby Cole

    Bobby Cole Supreme Member
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    Free Will......
     
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  13. Lambert Regenlöf

    Lambert Regenlöf Well-Known Member
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    God might be kind, just, compassionate, forgiving, and all that. I am kind, just, compassionate, forgiving, and more. Yet I have punished people. I have both forgiven for a misdeed and also punished for the same misdeed. Punishment and forgiveness are not mutually exclusive.

    Instead of thinking God is like what other people tell you It is like, you would do beyter if you figured out for yourself what God is like. Obviously God is not arbitrary, nor is God looking to inflict maximum misery. Then, given the way you conceive God to be, "why do bad things happen?"

    As for "pain", what a blessing that is, right? Without pain, if you put your hand on a hot burner, you wouldn't pull it away. You wouldn't avoid sunburns, go to a doctor when you break a bone, bother to pull a nail out of your foot, take care of an abcessed tooth, or a million other things that keep us healthy and (temporarily) alive (physically).
     
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  14. Frank Sanoica

    Frank Sanoica Supreme Member
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    @Lambert Regenlöf

    Physical pain is completely different from MENTAL pain, which is what I spoke of. I see no reason whatever to equate physical pain with religious leaning.

    Frank
     
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  15. Hedi Mitchell

    Hedi Mitchell Supreme Member
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    :( sorry ..was going to make a unlikeable post- decided to pass instead
     
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