Not all instances are alike in my opinion. Like I mentioned before ...my friend I'm sure always wanted to be a boy and probably felt like one and trust me her family was not one that would have encouraged that. It can be parent influenced ..I'm not saying that but in my friend's case, it wasn't. I always felt she became a lesbian not because she was a girl liking girls but because she felt like a boy and thus liked girls. This was in the early 60's and there wasn't much talk yet of even homosexuality at least nor for us at the age of 10. I didn't even know,what normal sex was let alone what a lesbian was...I just knew she acted like a boy, so thought tomboy but she never outgrew it.
I think that there are a mix of male/female attributes in all people, as far as how a person might feel. Your example of your childhood friend is a very good one, @Chrissy Cross . Even though people are born into one physical body, that is either a male one or a female one, I think that the mind and emotions might no always fit that body. Using little girls as the example still, you will see some that want to wear dresses and play with dolls, and other girls who are total tomboys, like your friend was; and they might r might not grow up to be homosexual. When I was a kid, I was more of the tomboy type, played with capguns and loved being a cowboy (or even an Indian), and really didn’t care about dolls, even though I had dolls. But I didn’t have any desire to actually BE a boy, and one of my earliest desires was to grow up and marry Roy Rogers, my hero. So many of the drugs that people take also affect hormones, and now, they are even in many water systems and in the ocean because doctors have people on some kind of drugs from the time they are born until they die, nowdays. Even different foods affect hormone production; so if a person is getting too little (or too much) of testosterone or estrogen produced in their body, it is going to change how they think and feel. There is also the question of abuse, especially with women. Sometimes, after an abusive relationship/marriage; women will not want to have any more men in their life, and will become a lesbian for that reason. And just like people can change into being homosexual, some will change back out of that, for whatever reason; so it does not always have to be a lifelong thing. Many years ago, I had friends who were married; but before they met each other, the husband had been gay. The last I knew of them, they were raising a family, and happily married together. The whole issue is just a lot more complicated than what physical gender you are born into, it would seem.
I had a tomboy period also...think it was because I had a brother a year younger and I wanted cars instead if dolls just like he got at Christmas but that only lasted a couple years. My friend tried to go the normal route, got married and even had two girls but soon divorced and has been a lesbian ever since. There was no abuse in her life or anything like that. I met her when I was 10 and always saw her more as a boy even though I didn't know what that meant at the time. She was not the friend I played dolls with that's for sure... She was great at sports and was even better than the boys. We all hung out together though and played the usually street games that were played back then plus jacks on my porch but never dolls.
It is interesting how these things can be, and it only happens with humans, because animals only mate with the opposite sex, and seem to have no problem understanding the difference or which gender that they are. There have been people who lived their life secretly being a different sex than they were born into, but I think that it was usually women who lived life as a man, rather than the other way around, and sometimes, it was not discovered until the person died. I don’t agree with the idea of not labeling a baby as a male or female, because they are obviously physically, either one or the other. They should be raised to know what sex they are, and if they grow up to feel different, then they have to deal with that issue at that time. The whole thing is just a very confusing subject.
If we take away the last few post dealing with specific belief systems, there really is a nitch whereby religion does play a part and so does science and psychology but they are, to me, *pseudo* science, religion and psychology. Certainly, within each designation of gender there falls a plethora of genetic traits which deal with the predisposition for certain physical and mental workings for which there is no choice. One of the most stark revealings is the propensity for certain males to display effeminate traits and females who display the opposite which again, is a natural thing for which free will cannot become a part. Now, if those effeminate traits in boys (example) is expanded upon and the gender ( because of those traits) becomes in question, then is when the word “pseudo” comes into play. Now, bear with me if you will.. Religion is that which we derive moral values from which also help define ethics. In the realm of morality, we have a personal accounting and responsibility which are components of free choice. In the realm of ethics, if one does not have free choice then one is no longer held accountable for their actions and in the case of gender designations, is where the psychological and scientific worlds collide with the prior. In order to give some credulity to gender “mis-assignment” and relieve an individual of any feelings of guilt or accountability if you will, psychologists have rendered a response based on feelings rather than reality which also gives science and the surgeon an ethical reason for a more permanent physical solution. Now, is there a new branch of main stream religious sects which recognize gender mis-assignments? Most certainly and complete with their own neologism, as it were, and more appropriately (or not) backed by a man made psychology with the scientists nodding their heads. To me, the whole affair is fit for the ouroborus ( snake eating it’s tail) as a symbolic view of the whole belief system and semantics used to detail the new wave of a nil choice mental apparitions.
But....I know many people with no religion or even a belief in God that are highly moral. I don't think religious people are the only ones with high morals. I also know Christians with no morals at all and filled with hate...it's a mixed bag in my opinion. I'm also out of this thread....people are different ...what's right for one isn't always right for another. And you can't force your beliefs on others....just worry about yourself and do the best for you and yours. That's what's wrong with the world today.....both sides think theirs is the only way and it's a constant battle. I'm my real life I probably think very much the same as all of you on here but I struggle with that and want to be more tolerant. Like I said elsewhere....the golden rule is the best way to live. At least strive for...were not perfect and never will be. I personally don't even understand transgender let alone all the other variations but it's not my life and I feel that person has the right to be happy.
(highlighted in red)..….very controversial. (highlighted in lavender)…….the GLBT community sure tries all the time. As far as "tolerant" goes, many Christians go by what the Bible says about two genders...…...a male and a female, nothing else. Wife and I aren't that tolerant of some things and we don't have to be. There are many things in our society that people just don't want to tolerate and for darn good reasons.
I said nobody can force their beliefs on others....not who tries. It's not right ...doesn't matter who does it is what I'm saying. I also said I'm done with this topic so don't bother quoting me or changing colors. Im DONE! PS..I don't tolerate people who judge people on wether they're wearing cowboy clothes or not...and won't accept them.
That's your choice to do, but you'd be judged if you wore Western clothes in downtown Los Angeles or NYC. People may not say anything, but would definitely look at you. You don't like judging people, that's entirely up to you, but there are those that do and should. One other thing, can't tell another member what to do on a forum like this. Only the Admin can do that. Sorry, but it is a FREE forum.
Well quote me all you want! Are you serious about NYC? There's a guy that stands in the street in his underwear in a cowboy hat...he's famous. This isn't even the guy I saw...he was older and no guitar....I think you can pretty much wear whatever in NYC without anyone even looking twice at you. Actually, only God should judge people...not you or I.
Oh, Chrissy, COME ON!! You should know what I'm talking about. Not some "dufuss" doing that. Do your even know what a cowboy is or looks like? If that guy is what you think a person in Western wear looks like...…..
Actually you will find many people in California, especially Fresno wearing cowboy hats and jeans and boots. That's the typical outfit of all the Mexican lawn care guys and the ones in the fields. I don't know if the jeans are Wrangler though. We live at a time when people,basically wear whatever they please...there really isn't a set fashion...nobody would look twice at someone dressed as a cowboy in CA. I'll take a pic of Alfonso for ya on Friday....you'd think he was a cowboy.
You still don't get what I'm saying, but that's ok. Think I'm going to be like Babs Hunt and just let you think what you want to. Arguing does get old. But, believe it or not, I can find threads and posts where we both agreed on things.
I know "the clothes don't make a cowboy". In pro-rodeo I was a Team Roper and the organization had a dress code we had to follow when in the arena. I've seen cowboys and cowgirls working at a Stockyards and all of them were wearing Wranglers, Western shirt, boots and either a baseball cap (worn the right way) or a cowboy hat. Western clothes have a lot to do with the way a cowboy looks. I should know. I mean, you do know that I'm a former pro-rodeo cowboy, right? I went to a Roping School in Norco, California. It's pretty obvious that I know much more about the cowboy lifestyle, thru magazines and meeting them, than you do. Nothing against you, but PLEASE don't try to outdo me on Western/cowboy knowledge. Mexican landscape workers are not cowboys, just like many nightclub people, dressed in Western clothes know nothing about horses, rodeo or other Western stuff. When I was in rodeo, I had a nightclub sponsor me and a Saddle Bronc Rider. Visit Centennial Livestock Auction in Ft. Collins, Colorado if you want to see real cowboys. Heck, look up the website, Cowboy Culture/ Travel Wyoming. Picture of a real cowboy right there.