Ww2 Discussion

Discussion in 'History & Geography' started by Richard Whiting, Feb 7, 2023.

  1. Don Roles

    Don Roles Well-Known Member
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    Again Richard you jog my memory, I have heard of all those descriptions but had not really twigged what they were ..... now I shall see an army base every time I drive past the neighbors...
     
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  2. Richard Whiting

    Richard Whiting Very Well-Known Member
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    During the blitz, the East End of London was always the hardest hit, because the flats were crowded among industry and docks, AND the civilians who lived there suffered the most casualties. Possibly because they didn't have any garden to build a safe shelter. During the "blitz" alone, 43,000 civilians were killed.
     
    #137
    Last edited: Sep 7, 2023
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  3. Don Roles

    Don Roles Well-Known Member
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    This discussion peaked my interest in my mothers activities during the war years as I was aware that she was in the Women's Civil defense and also delivered mail to the area at Alverstoke (near Portsmouth) where the Mulberry Harbour was built. Upon going through some archives I have here I see that I not only have some Clothing ration books but an invitation to a function at the County Hall, Westminster Bridge, London on 14 Nov 1944 along with 30 woman from various services from the Southern Region.

    In the paperwork I have just examined is the instructions, travel details and her following report of the event.

    I will copy / transcribe those if there is any interest which I presume there may well be some!
     
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  4. Don Roles

    Don Roles Well-Known Member
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    See below the instructions for attendance at the 1944 Woman's Civil Deference Rally in London a few months before WWII officially ended. A write up of the proceedings by an attendee will follow as soon as I finish transcribing it.

    1944Invite_1.jpeg

    1944invite2_2.jpeg
     
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  5. Don Roles

    Don Roles Well-Known Member
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    The following is a transcript of a type written document passed down by my mother who at the time lived near Gosport, just across the harbour from the home of the British Navy in Portsmouth, and where much of the Mulberry Harbour that was instrumental in the retaking of France was built and to which base my mother delivered mail.


    Report on the National Rally for Women of the Civil Defense and Kindred Services.
    6th December 1944

    A party of about 60 women, representing various woman's services from the Southern Region, gathered at Waterloo Station at 12 noon on December 6th 1944. I was proud to be among them.
    We then proceeded to Elthem House, Cornwall Road where we were given lunch along with several other parties from various other Regions.
    After lunch we were given tickets for a National Rally of Woman of the Civil Defense, to be held at 3.30 p.m. At the County Hall, Westminster Bridge, and taken by coaches to the County Hall where we found many other parties had arrived, and more were still arriving. The majority were seated in the Council Chambers from where Her Majesty the Queen later spoke. The remainder, I among them, were in a Committee room. When everyone had arrived we were told for the first time that Her Majesty the Queen would address us.

    Twelve Regions were represented, and two representatives from various towns were present, making approximately 600 women present. Two representatives from each region were to be presented to Her Majesty. I was pleased to the hear that the two chosen from the southern region were from Portsmouth and the Isle of Wight. They were Miss Scarlett, a St Johns nurse from a first aid post in Portsmouth who I noticed was wearing one medal ribbon of the B.E.M. and Mrs Burgess of Ryde, Isle of Wight a Women Fire Guard Officer.
    I noticed many and varied uniforms and badges as well as better known branches of the Civil Defense, Fire Guard and Woman's Voluntary Services. There were various Nursing Services, Police Woman, American Ambulance Unit in Great Britian, and also a number of civilians whose work was identified by armbands, such as Fire Guard, M of F, M of I, Rest Center, and London Meals Service. It was a very mixed and colorful gathering.
    While waiting for Her Majesty to arrive we were played a programe of music, including the London Scottish March, and Mendelssohn's Fantasia, by the East Ham A.R.P. Orchestra. The playing of The National Athem announced the arrival of Her Majesty the Queen accompanied by her Royal Highness Princess Elizabeth, at about 4.15 PM.
    After a short address by the Ministry of Home Security, Mr H. Morrison and the Ministry of Health, Mr Winnick we then heard the voice of Her Majesty which came to us in the Committee Rooms over the speakers.

    Her Majesty spoke very movingly of the part women had played in the War, saying she was sure the war could never be won if women had not taken on the numerous jobs they had. She praised all branches of every service, and mentioned especially the women who had given their services voluntarily to various organizations after a hard days work in a factory, or at home with all the difficulties of wartime housekeeping. Her Majesty also said that when future generations looked back on this terrible war they would recognise the great part women played, and what women had endured in this time of war may save our children from another.
    Her Majesty concluded by thanking the women in the name of the country in which that had served, for a difficult job magnificently done. Then came three heart cheers for Her Majesty. After that those in the Committee Room waited expectantly with eyes glued to the door. In a few minuets in walked Her Majesty, charmingly attired in black with a string of pearls around her neck. She was closely followed by the Princess Elizabeth who wore a simple coat and hat of grey.
    The 24 representatives to be presented were in a semicircle facing us and we were thrilled to see Her Majesty and Her Royal Highness shake hands and speak to each in turn. She then turned and spoke to one or two others in the room before leaving. The great moment was over, everyone was very excited and pleased.

    We were the entertained to tea, and before leaving where shown a model of the City of London in 1616, originally made for a film, it was a wonderful sight and well worth seeing. The excitement was over and we made our various ways back home, those who remaining were entertained to a cinema show. It was all together a very exciting and interesting day which I shall remember always and felt proud to be among those present.


    NOTES
    The British Empire Medal (B.E.M.) is granted in recognition of meritorious civil or military service.
    It is unclear what the civilian service M of F and M of I refer to, perhaps someone can tell us.
    We assume that Elthem House refers to what is now Eltham Palace which was given to the Royal Army Educational Corps in March 1945;
     
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  6. Richard Whiting

    Richard Whiting Very Well-Known Member
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    I strongly believe that the Nazi's would have won WW2 IF Hitler had not interfered with his military.
    Take Dunkirk as one example. Hitler ordered the land forces, tanks etc. to stop advancing just as they were about to destroy the B.E.F at Dunkirk. Why did he do that ? So that the Luftwaffe could also take credit in the victory.

    Of course there are many other examples of Hitler's interference. Like the HUGE mistake of attacking the Soviet Union in 1942 (Operation Barbarossa)
     
    #141
  7. Tom Galty

    Tom Galty Veteran Member
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    Russia was attacked in 1941 six months before the attack on Pearl Harbour.

    Hitlers Mistake was declaring war on the Americans after the Pearl Harbour attack, it opened the Door to Europe to the American forces.
     
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  8. Richard Whiting

    Richard Whiting Very Well-Known Member
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    Yes, you are correct. I made a typo and I didn't catch it. The 1941 attack on the Soviet Union was Operation Barbarossa.
     
    #143
  9. Richard Whiting

    Richard Whiting Very Well-Known Member
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    As Tom Galty pointed out, Hitler's next huge mistake was declaring war on America just a few days after Japan had attacked Pearl Harbor.
    No only did America have a huge potential for manufacturing war materials, it had vast oil reserves. Soon America was producing 3 brand new Liberty ships every 2 days. AND, the auto industry shut down and converted their assembly lines and produced in excess of 50,000 war planes.

    It makes me wonder if Hitler had the vaguest notion of how much America could produce .
     
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  10. Marie Mallery

    Marie Mallery Veteran Member
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    Don, it seems the movie, ' Tora,Tora,Tora ' also hints at this. Much of the movie seemed factual.
     
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  11. Marie Mallery

    Marie Mallery Veteran Member
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    Don guess I can add history to my senility.
    I thought Pearl Harbor was the act that caused us to nuke Japan?
     
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  12. Don Alaska

    Don Alaska Supreme Member
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    Pearl Harbor was the match that ignited our participation in the war, but Japan's aggression in China and our reaction to that (sanctions) was led Japan to devise the attack. The bombs at the end of the war undoubtedly saved lives on both sides as our firebombing of Tokyo and other major cities actually killed more people than Hiroshima and Nagasaki did.
     
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  13. Marie Mallery

    Marie Mallery Veteran Member
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    Thanks for the info. I didn't know this.
     
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  14. Marie Mallery

    Marie Mallery Veteran Member
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    We are watching it again now, another good thing about being old is you can watch movies more than once.

     
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  15. Lambert Regenlöf

    Lambert Regenlöf Well-Known Member
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    Poor Adolf. He can't win for losing. If he declares war against the U.S. after the U.S. declares war against Japan, that shows he is an incompetent judge of military abilities, thus is not fit to lead. If he does not declare war against the U.S. after the U.S. declares war against Japan, that shows he does not honor Germany's treaties with other nations, thus is not fit to lead. If he does both, he is a schizophrenic madman, thus not fit to lead. If he says, "Fight on! Never surrender!" (as Beneš and Churchill did), he is a self-destructive, suicidal maniac, thus not fit to lead. If he pleas for peace as national leaders with at least a modicum of courage commonly do, he is a spectacular coward, thus not fit to lead. The modern caricaturisation of Adolf is such that it can be truly said of him that he is "worse than Hitler."
     
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